tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3522363391639455008.post2607160866795136607..comments2023-10-06T06:36:05.465-07:00Comments on SCOTTISH SCRIBBLES: Andrew de MorayJodyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11983608069357021786noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3522363391639455008.post-43812267992967205282015-09-11T09:49:48.243-07:002015-09-11T09:49:48.243-07:00Warfare is a fascinating subject. Despite the dubi...Warfare is a fascinating subject. Despite the dubious morality of using violence to achieve personal or political aims. It remains that conflict has been used to do just that throughout recorded history.<br /><br />Your article is very well done, a good read.Geraldhttp://www.greatmilitarybattles.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3522363391639455008.post-40913222835026348042010-09-14T12:35:07.890-07:002010-09-14T12:35:07.890-07:00Morganne,
I think it comes down to his death so s...Morganne, <br />I think it comes down to his death so soon after the battle, within months, which is a huge factor. And this coupled with the fact he didn't have a "Blind Harry" type to sing his praises what 300 years after the fact. <br /><br />And I think Wallace coming from a minor knightly family rather than from the peers family as the de Moray's were I think going back to the moreamars (sp?) of Moray that makes him more apealing to the common man. <br /><br />I just think it is a shame that there is no memorial to de Moray in Scotland to commemorate his and later his son's contribution to the battle for Scottish Independence.Jodyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11983608069357021786noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3522363391639455008.post-56865261216216132252010-09-14T08:43:33.371-07:002010-09-14T08:43:33.371-07:00Great post Jody. I think as historians and as fic...Great post Jody. I think as historians and as fiction writers, the tendency is to write what we've read. Not always a good thing ~ never a good thing without research. That said, there is some good although sparce information written in "popular" history about Andrew de Moray aka. Murray. James Mackay in his book about William Wallace, BRAVE HEART, gives Moray significant credit for rising "the common men" in the northeast and successfully leading the revolt there, specifically metioning Urquhart, Banff, Elgin and Inverness. Most legitimate scholars I've read list de Moray as a Guardian of Scotland equal to Wallace before his(Andrew's) death. Most also indicate he was mortally wounded at Stirling. J.D. Mackie indicates this in "A HISTORY OF SCOTLAND", but the info on Andrew is sparce at best. Evan Barron, THE SCOTTISH WAR OF INDEPENDENCE(1934)posits that Moray "rather than Wallace" was the main leader of the struggle for independence. Mackay acknowledges this in a footnote in Ch. 5 of his book on William Wallace. Even Magnus Magnusson, one of my favorite historians (next to you of course :) ) skims over Moray who he refers to as Murray, although he does acknowledge Murray and Wallace as "de facto joint rulers of Scotland, working in the name of John Balliol, the deposed king" and he acknowledges that people of Scotland rallied to both, not just Wallace. So why does Wallace get so much press? Is it the timing of de Moray's death? Is it the bloody and flamboyant way Wallace was killed? Thanks for raising this heroe's accomplishments and giving voice to history too long marginalized.<br /><br />Great Post!Morgannehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15361470830000423798noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3522363391639455008.post-80763290803362294882010-09-12T14:04:13.818-07:002010-09-12T14:04:13.818-07:00Great research, Jody. Thanks for the link. I'v...Great research, Jody. Thanks for the link. I've been (on and off) reading up about Andrew de Moray as I think he's been forgotten about.<br /><br />Incidentally, I'm in the process of researching the de Moray family as the (fictional) MFC in my new WIP (set shortly after Falkirk) is distantly related to Andrew. Your post helped a lot. Thanks! :-) <br /><br />PS - Scottish MPs often suggest all sorts of historical accolades but sadly most of it is for publicity only. Wish they'd take it more seriously instead of just using their history as a PR gag when elections are coming up.Cathie Dunnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08537946350336674340noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3522363391639455008.post-78019045097818141642010-09-12T13:44:12.742-07:002010-09-12T13:44:12.742-07:00great blog, Jopdy. Lots of history containede wit...great blog, Jopdy. Lots of history containede within it.Mary Johttp://www.maryjoscheibl.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3522363391639455008.post-34065982266569428082010-09-12T12:53:54.900-07:002010-09-12T12:53:54.900-07:00Thanks Renee. Do you write Scottish romances or ju...Thanks Renee. Do you write Scottish romances or just interested in Scotland?Jodyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11983608069357021786noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3522363391639455008.post-54739987545945626612010-09-12T12:52:29.305-07:002010-09-12T12:52:29.305-07:00Keena I want to believe your story too. It depends...Keena I want to believe your story too. It depends on which side of the tale you hear. The English tale states they knocked down the bridge but my question why would you do that as it would mean certain death for your men trapped there. <br />I tend to believe it was the Scots to add to the confusion as confusion was their greatest tool in winning this battle because they were so outnumbered. <br /><br />I love this story and that it was a Williams makes it better as that is my maiden name so I am a bit partial to Williams stories.Jodyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11983608069357021786noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3522363391639455008.post-23194644796159558252010-09-12T12:26:15.407-07:002010-09-12T12:26:15.407-07:00Wonderful blog, Jody!Wonderful blog, Jody!Reneehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10661396654827059313noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3522363391639455008.post-77293714420433128152010-09-12T12:07:51.919-07:002010-09-12T12:07:51.919-07:00Hi, Jody. Great blog. It reminded me of a bus driv...Hi, Jody. Great blog. It reminded me of a bus driver I met in Stirling when I was there a few years ago with my mother. His name was Pins Williams. And according to Pins, his ancestor had been one of the men who climbed beneath Stirling Bridge and knocked out the pins holding it together, so that it collapsed when the English were halfway across.<br /><br />William Wallace gave the man the nickname, Pins, and in honor of that, he named his son Pins, who named his son Pins, etc., etc. until he was named Pins. He didn't have any sons, so he lamented the fact that he was the last Pins Williams, but one of his daughters named her son Pins.<br /><br />Whether true or not (the journalist in me is always skeptic) I think it's a great story, and shows--as you point out--that William Wallace didn't win that day alone, contrary to history or Hollywood.Keena Kincaidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15985958126062809043noreply@blogger.com